How to Grow Tobacco

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 Post subject: canning tobacco
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 9:20 pm 
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Location: Wichita ks
I know you can can everything from bread to meat but can you can tobacco? I can all my veggies for the year and have storagespace to add more jars for baccy but don't really know what the heat would do to it. Anyone have any thoughts on this?


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 Post subject: Re: canning tobacco
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 10:02 pm 
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Location: central coast of Kalifornia
Sure!

I think it sounds like a good idea.

...I'd have it fully cured, stable, and dried well before sealing it up, though...
Good luck!
rc


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 Post subject: Re: canning tobacco
PostPosted: Thu Apr 07, 2011 5:34 am 
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Joined: Wed Aug 26, 2009 1:16 pm
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Location: West Central Fl.
hi
sure can can. prince Albert in a can? Velvet. Lee


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 Post subject: Re: canning tobacco
PostPosted: Thu Apr 07, 2011 8:00 am 
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Joined: Thu Jan 01, 2009 10:16 am
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Location: near Rising Sun,Maryland USA
So the question remains.. "how" would you can it? Veggies and such are canned with water. The idea in canning, really, is just to kill off the bacteria thru high heat, then pull a vacuum to seal the lid tight so nothing gets in. I would think, to can tobacco all you would have to do is get some jars really hot, like pour boiling water in them, wait a while-then empty. Add your baccy, seal and as they cool, the lid will get sucked down. But now the question.. with no "air" will they stagnate and cease to age as you would normally want a tobacco to do? I would think that maybe for long term storage like 10 years or so this would be a good idea. Other than that I do not see an anvantage to it.

Randy B


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 Post subject: Re: canning tobacco
PostPosted: Thu Apr 07, 2011 8:13 am 
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Location: central coast of Kalifornia
How to do it, and why?

I think I would just dry pack a jar with cured leaf, warm it to expel excess O2... water bath or other heat... then close the top down tightly to prevent anything from getting in from ambient.

Why?
I think it could keep the fiber from degenerating...

Seems there's a difference between veggies for food consumption and the baccy, though.
With veggies we are trying to preserve the nutritional value of the cell structure.
With baccy, the fiber structure is important, but we want the inherent chems, and not necessarily the nutritional qualities.

Guess it would be ez to tell I'm not a physio-botanist. :roll:

Best
rc


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 Post subject: Re: canning tobacco
PostPosted: Thu Apr 07, 2011 4:07 pm 
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Location: Wichita ks
How to do it and why.

I will start with the why, I don't know. Long term storage I guess. I'm all about just in case the stuff hits the fan, not the 55 gal barrel of pepsi and 300 rolls of tp type, the I want to know how to do everything and store it when I'm done type. The how to do it, I was tinking the water bath wouldn't work because it would float to much. I have a large pressure cooker for canning and maybe that would work. I also been looking into it and I know the vacuum sealer for masons would work. I was also thinking heating the cans, adding the baccy and maybe putting them in the oven for a little.


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 Post subject: Re: canning tobacco
PostPosted: Thu Apr 07, 2011 4:55 pm 
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Location: West Central Fl.
hi
As I said you can can. The better question was should you?
When I first thought about growing my own ,one of the first things I saw was storage. What was recomened was to store in cardboard boxes in attic or dry clossets. The tobacco ages while being stored . So in fact gets better with age.
Brings back to question. Why can. I think dry cardboard boxes is still recomended. I have acess to a lot of boxes cheaper than jars. I think The best would be a baled like lonnies or mountain man . Then stored in boxes could sure get alot stored for long time. Lee


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 Post subject: Re: canning tobacco
PostPosted: Thu Apr 07, 2011 5:16 pm 
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Location: near Blacksburg, VA
If you just allow the fully cured tobacco to reach a state of feeling dry, but not brittle, that would be in a relative humidity of about 60 to 65%, then seal it from the environment, it will keep for many years (maybe decades), while slowly aging. Sealing the tobacco can be done with a finger-tight mason jar that has been warmed, but not hot. You could, of course, spend a lot less money and space by sealing it in easily labeled Ziplock freezer bags, which you could double if you're nervous about its minute vapor transpiration.

When the leaf becomes too dry, aging stops until the humidity gets over about 60% again. While the box in the attic can work, it subjects the tobacco to environmental changes in temperature and humidity, which may or may not produce favorable results. If the humidity is perfect at daytime temperatures, but the temperature drops 20ºF in the attic, then suddenly the relative humidity inside the box may double.

I would assume that the larger the baled quantity, the more stable its immediate environment. The temperature and humidity inside a 600 pound bale will probably come very close to the weekly average temp and humidity. A shoe box of tobacco, though, will swing with the hourly changes. If you store sealed tobacco inside your living space, then both temperature and humidity are held in a narrower range.

I think the idea of treating the tobacco as though it were a vegetable to be cooked, may have unexpected effects. Aside from the direct effect of high heat on the color, texture and flavor of the leaf, if you take it over 149ºF, you lose most of its ability to profitably age. Over 189ºF will destroy the last vestige of the aging enzymes.

Bob


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 Post subject: Re: canning tobacco
PostPosted: Thu Apr 07, 2011 5:27 pm 
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Location: West Central Fl.
ok
I guess the guys that wrote the books that I read didn't know what they were doing either . Sorry Lee


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 Post subject: Re: canning tobacco
PostPosted: Thu Apr 07, 2011 6:13 pm 
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Location: West Central Fl.
Hi
Just made me think of something. I ordered some tubes the other day and they said what are you useing them in I told them and they said that size won't work. I said ok I'll teel my wife to not use them any more they won't work. Geez :lol: Lee


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 Post subject: Re: canning tobacco
PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 12:48 am 
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Location: near Blacksburg, VA
smbdyiam wrote:
ok
I guess the guys that wrote the books that I read didn't know what they were doing either . Sorry Lee

Lee,
I'm only suggesting that some of the methods that are used for storing tobacco subject it to the mercy of the weather.

I air-cure all my leaf in a shed with a simple vent fan. I've had no problem with pole burn or mold. But the credit for that is not mine. That success is the result of fortunate weather.

So, I don't agree that a box in the attic is the best choice, even though I know it has worked out satisfactorily for some people in some climates. I don't agree that attempting a water or steam "canning" method is a prudent way to treat fine tobacco.

I'm always open to changing my mind in the face of new information. I would be interested in reading the books that contradict my science, or anything that I've suggested.

Bob


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 Post subject: Re: canning tobacco
PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 4:00 am 
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Location: West Central Fl.
hi
first line we wre not talking about curing we were talking about storing . I do not store tobacco outside or subject to weather.
Second line still not talking about curing it was about storing.
Third Lines I had stated that one of the first things I learned was about storage in boxes, in attic or dry closset. I did not limit it to attic . Although I believe it works and is sutible for most areas. I did not say that canning would not work I said that I thought boxes and baling was abetter - best way- to store tobacco.
Fifth line I was not controdicting what you said. I posted twice before you posted telling why boxes in attics- not clossets this time- was not best. so I did not controdict something . I did agree that canning was possible .
Last the first book that I read was when I ordered seeds from an online company that I will not name as roy prefers. The book is jim Johnsons "Growing and processing tobacco at home. " The second place I read this is HERE. this is about storing tobacco . the first posts under storing tobacco deal with this. In fact the first dozen is what I remembered the most, I store my tobacco in paper boxes and some in paper bags. I store in the closset and some in my kiln when I'm not using it as kiln. 40 cubic feet. I also store a box of tobacco in family room next to shreader. but it is all in boxes or paper bags. I also have some that Lonnie baled and sent me as samples . I have some of that left in a box in family room and I still think it is best way. Least amount of space and stay good . In fact gets better. So this is not new Information just rehash of older posts.
The first posts were under "storing tobacco the basics." Actualy the whole subject line is good reading again.
As a side note I recieved a message to look at c48 cartons. wow look what the big boys use. google c48 cartons and tobacco . kept for years in BOXES. hope this helps about my opinions
Lee
Ps I do not use attic It is to hard to get into here . I would if I had differant access to it . Lee Page 27 on book


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 Post subject: Re: canning tobacco
PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 4:18 am 
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Posts: 524
I havent been fortunate to have enough tobacco to need long term storage.(yet) Just before the schip tax imposed on ryo tobacco went into effect in April 2009 I bought a lot of tobacco to tide me by until I could harvest my own. I just stored the bags in a refrigerator at 35 degrees. I still have a few bags left and the tobacco is just fine after two years. Meybe a little better than two years ago. I do not plan to use the bags I have left over any time soon.
My next door neighbor bought ahead also and stores hers in a root cellar, she probably has enough to hold her over another couple of years. I think it will be just fine for her in two more years. She keeps it dark in the root cellar also.
With that said I believe that any airtight container should work satisfactorily. Keep the temperatures moderate and keep it dark. It will probably get better with age.

Dr.Bob


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 Post subject: Re: canning tobacco
PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 11:02 pm 
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Joined: Tue Aug 04, 2009 6:03 am
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Well my 2 centsa agrees with air tight containers of any kind . Zip locks work for a few months but will dry out over a winter if kept inside a heated home .

I seal mine in several layers of glad wrap and I mean several layers maybe 15 of them . Many in one direction and then many in the other direction .

I dont exactly agree with dark . In fact I'm just about to place mine back in an old truck for a second round of heat treatment . If your RH and temps were perfect keeping things air tight might not be that important .

However in my location the RH can be 50 one day and 100% the next day and containers that dont prevent the tobacco from sucking up this moisture woul;d ruin it fast here in my parts . So I'm sure location and the enviorment there must be a big consideration for anyone storing tobacco .

ok maybe that was 3 cents :roll:


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 Post subject: Re: canning tobacco
PostPosted: Sat Apr 09, 2011 3:09 am 
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Joined: Sun Apr 05, 2009 6:55 am
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Lonnie
I said AIR TIGHT containers. not sorta air tight.
Dr.Bob


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