How to Grow Tobacco

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 Post subject: Jar fermentation
PostPosted: Wed Dec 10, 2014 2:40 pm 
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Joined: Wed Nov 26, 2014 12:20 pm
Posts: 32
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Hohoo!
Do anyone have a good experience with Jar fermenting? Seems like one of the cheapest and easiest ways to ferment..


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 Post subject: Re: Jar fermentation
PostPosted: Fri Dec 12, 2014 12:42 am 
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Joined: Thu Apr 09, 2009 3:45 pm
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Location: Houston, TX
This is a new one on me but is this is for storage after curing?


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 Post subject: Re: Jar fermentation
PostPosted: Fri Dec 12, 2014 4:52 am 
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Joined: Wed Nov 26, 2014 12:20 pm
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Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Its a way to hurry up the curing like using a kiln. I guess it works like any fermenting process like kimchi and saurkraut. The humidity should be kept but still important to check for mold. During the process they release gas that you have to let out abd that also keep down humidity a little. Found a good link http://www.herbtalk.info/forums/index.php?topic=606.0


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 Post subject: Re: Jar fermentation
PostPosted: Fri Dec 12, 2014 9:55 am 
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Joined: Thu Jan 16, 2014 8:56 am
Posts: 47
Location: Iola TEXAS,
I have used jars, Ziploc bags, boxes it all works great as long as no smell is transferred to you leaf. I also use a fermentation chamber to speed things along. Controlled temps around 125 and 70% humidity for 35 days or so this can replace years of dry storage.


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 Post subject: Re: Jar fermentation
PostPosted: Fri Dec 12, 2014 11:32 am 
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Joined: Wed Nov 26, 2014 12:20 pm
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Location: Stockholm, Sweden
How do you determined when the leafs are ready to be put in jars? Right color but still little moist and flexible?


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 Post subject: Re: Jar fermentation
PostPosted: Fri Dec 12, 2014 1:43 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jan 16, 2014 8:56 am
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Location: Iola TEXAS,
If you are storing for long term the leaves need to be in light case before storing to prevent mold.


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 Post subject: Re: Jar fermentation
PostPosted: Fri Aug 21, 2015 11:53 am 
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Joined: Mon Jun 08, 2015 7:14 am
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I am new at this, so I don't really have advice. I can just tell you what I am doing.

I am more or less following the advice I found on here:
http://www.heirloomtobacco.com/Garden_Coop.html

I bought 1/2 gallon jars and 2 1/2 gallon jars for curing because I have 120 plants. I just started curing one batch although I have interrupted it a lot because I started it in a roaster pan.

I ordered hygrometers from Ohio Curing and Preserving. They had the best price and looked like a decent quality. I accidentally bought the analog cure caps but I prefer the digital hygrometers because they have both temperature and humidity. My husband fitted the digital hygrometers, that are not the cure caps, into the lids of the 2 1/2 gallon jars. http://www.cureand.com/cure-cap-types.html

I am currently getting 69% humidity.

Keep me posted on how you are doing, so I can learn your lessons. :)


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 Post subject: Re: Jar fermentation
PostPosted: Fri Oct 02, 2015 1:42 am 
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Joined: Wed Nov 26, 2014 12:20 pm
Posts: 32
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Cool to see you try this one as well!
I read the same advice as you, from heirloomtobacco. The first attempts I made, had been stored the same duration as heirloom recommended and at 26C but I never achieved that tobacco aroma and smell. I had grown my first plants indoors, in quite small buckets, maybe overdone fertilizer and using bad light, they looked okay but I think they will never be smokeable. They were quite easy to keep away from mold actually, probably because they were grown inside and during winter with extremely little moldspores in the air. One more idea is that if I overdid the fertilizer, the chemicals inside the leafs are to harsh for mold. Haha sounds lethal to smoke. With almost wet leafs, mold occured ofcourse.

Now I have started a new attempt with outdoors grown baccy, but its really hard to keep out mold! Its the white mold thats is always appearing, at the end of stems and in the cut in the stems from the knife. Maybe the leafs didnt get dryed out comepletely thru the leaf. Maybe that kills any moldspores that previously landed on the leaf, and after that you can mist them up again without problem.

How is it going for you? Been a month now? exciting!
Ive never seen curing caps, looks neat, must be perfect for this.


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 Post subject: Re: Jar fermentation
PostPosted: Sun Oct 04, 2015 6:41 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jul 26, 2015 9:03 am
Posts: 43
Location: North Dakota
Maybe it is not warm enough.... I have read that it can be as warm as 55c.... or about 140f.
I have heard that mold spores die at about 120f (about 45c I think).
I have packed a few quart canning jars and put them in the oven at about 135f... I don't know if it is hurting anything being that hot but when I open the jars the tobacco is a very hot, a little moist (because I moistened them before packing in the jars) and smells terrible. Ammonia dissipating I suppose.
Anyway, it seems to be working so far... I will let you know what finally happens.
I have also set up a fridge with a crock pot and have tobacco bundles stuffed on shelves near the top... keeping the fridge at about 135f and about 80% humidity. Also hot, moist and very stinky tobacco.
I will know which I like best in a couple of weeks I suppose.
I will say that if the jars in the oven work, it is far less trouble than the fridge with the crock pot.
Any advice?


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 Post subject: Re: Jar fermentation
PostPosted: Tue Oct 06, 2015 11:03 am 
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Joined: Tue Nov 13, 2012 12:41 pm
Posts: 17
Location: Southern Ontario
Maybe a dumb question, but what's the purpose behind jar fermentation? Is it to speed up aging, or an alternative to kilning? Is it done after colour curing?


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 Post subject: Re: Jar fermentation
PostPosted: Tue Oct 06, 2015 3:10 pm 
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Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Romanko: There's only dumb answers, like the reasons for jar curing is to make a leaf good for navigating at sea or stuffing a hat making it warm enough for winter. The real reason and smart answer is that it is an alternative to kilning. Which is the process of fermentation. Fermenting stuff in jars and containers have been done for thousands of years, so the same thing for baccy should work..

Yes it is done after color curing :) You can keep the right level of humidity easily in a closed container and I think fermenting prefers the enclosed microclimate or what to call it.

Preacherman:
Yeah ive read too that you shouldnt exceed 55c. Most people go around 50. Do you have a seperate thermometer in your oven? Ovens arent always that precise as they seem. Inside the leaf stack it should not exceed 120F. I actually read that moldspores like it the best around 25-45 C and they are exterminated around 70+. But they need oxygen.. so I guess tightly packed bunch will help?

I have made a kiln as well :) nice to hear your result later! I built one out of plywood, which i am kinda dissapointed with now that it is condensating lots of water and im afraid mold will get on the door. I dont know why i just had to build one out of plywood.. ive read all the instructions here at HTGT about fridges.. guess It sounded fun building one.. Haha. Ive had around 48 C and 73-80% humidity.


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 Post subject: Re: Jar fermentation
PostPosted: Wed Oct 07, 2015 7:59 am 
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Joined: Wed Jan 29, 2014 10:00 am
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Location: Richmond VA
I might try this with my twists in jars on the wood stove ledge. The top of the stove, above the blower, is is about 175 F on the metal so I'll put in a bit of insulator and keep a close eye on the temperature with one of those fancy infrared thermometers. I'll let you know how this works out but won't be able to start until it's actually cold enough to fire that thing up... maybe late November?


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 Post subject: Re: Jar fermentation
PostPosted: Wed Oct 07, 2015 8:17 am 
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Location: North Dakota
Ackebooa wrote:
Preacherman:
Yeah ive read too that you shouldnt exceed 55c. Most people go around 50. Do you have a seperate thermometer in your oven? Ovens arent always that precise as they seem. Inside the leaf stack it should not exceed 120F. I actually read that moldspores like it the best around 25-45 C and they are exterminated around 70+. But they need oxygen.. so I guess tightly packed bunch will help?

I have made a kiln as well :) nice to hear your result later! I built one out of plywood, which i am kinda dissapointed with now that it is condensating lots of water and im afraid mold will get on the door. I dont know why i just had to build one out of plywood.. ive read all the instructions here at HTGT about fridges.. guess It sounded fun building one.. Haha. Ive had around 48 C and 73-80% humidity.


I do have a thermometer in the oven... it varies between about 135F to 147F.
I have been opening the jars twice a day... they still smell very foul... but it is the same smell that the fridge-kiln is producing.
So far, I am liking the jars in the oven much better... it is much less of a mess, and if you go by the smell and the feel of the tobacco, it seems to be producing the same result.
The fridge-kiln is difficult to keep at a constant humidity. Also the humidity of the tobacco in the fridge is very inconsistent... some of it is dry as a bone and some of it is sopping. I shuffle it around and that seems to be working ok, but the jars in the oven-I just open them in the morning and let the vapors out, and if they are a little dry I will lightly mist the tobacco; then again in the evening.

probably a couple of weeks away from any finished product, but I will update.

JAK..... probably will work good with twists.... I might fear mold inside the twist once the fermentation is done.
I have read that different molds can tolerate different ranges of heat...some will die about 130F while others thrive and can stand over 150f.
I guess I don't know which mold grows on tobacco, but though I have had some mold issues while hanging and color curing, there has been no sign of any living mold on the tobacco in the fridge or the jars even though they are very moist.
I guess I'll see what happens when I dry it out after the fermentation.


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 Post subject: Re: Jar fermentation
PostPosted: Wed Oct 07, 2015 8:39 am 
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Joined: Wed Jan 29, 2014 10:00 am
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Location: Richmond VA
I have the twists hanging outside right now.They'll be good and dry before I start this process. Then any humidity will be added on the outside surface of the twist for the jar fermenting process. So I should be able to see any mold on the exterior and the inside should stay relatively dry and hopefully mold free.
When I cut it open I shall find out. I think the goal while kilning tobacco is to keep it hot enough to kill mold and make the enzymatic process faster but not too hot to stop the enzymatic processes and dry enough to prevent mold but moist enough to keep the enzymatic process moving. Which is why we shoot for 120ish degrees and 70ish% humidity.


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 Post subject: Re: Jar fermentation
PostPosted: Wed Oct 07, 2015 10:37 am 
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Joined: Sun Jul 26, 2015 9:03 am
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Location: North Dakota
So you think I am keeping things too hot?


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